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2026年11月1日 美国东部时间下午1:13 / CBS新闻

以下是佛蒙特州独立议员伯尼·桑德斯参议员的访谈 transcript,该访谈于2026年11月1日在《玛格丽特·布伦南主持的面对国家》节目中播出。

玛格丽特·布伦南:早上好,欢迎收看《面对国家》。再过几个小时,50个州的选民就将前往投票站,这次选举可能会改变华盛顿的权力平衡。我们首先邀请一位参与了大量竞选活动的嘉宾——尽管他本次无需寻求连任。他就是佛蒙特州独立议员伯尼·桑德斯,从伯灵顿连线我们。参议员,早上好。

参议员伯尼·桑德斯(佛蒙特州独立派):早上好。

玛格丽特·布伦南:我了解到你本周末在缅因州和密歇根州举办了线上集会与市政厅会议。你关注的还有佛罗里达州和明尼苏达州,涉及的候选人包括特洛伊·杰克逊、阿卜杜勒·赛义德。为什么选择佛罗里达?因为据CBS民调,该州大概率倾向共和党;而CBS同样将明尼苏达列为民主党大概率获胜的州。你为何聚焦这两个州?

桑德斯参议员:首先,我不认为任何结果是板上钉钉的。我觉得佛罗里达州的安杰伊·尼克松正在开展出色的基层竞选活动。她在民主党初选中实现了巨大的意外胜利。我认为她有真正的机会在大选中胜出。她正在动员全国的工薪阶层民众,关注的议题也切中要害。这些议题在明尼苏达、佛罗里达和佛蒙特都是一样的。民众对这样的经济状况感到厌恶和沮丧:亿万富翁的境况从未如此好过,而如今数百万民众却在为果腹、加油、付房租苦苦挣扎。埃隆·马斯克目前的个人财富已超过美国收入最低的53%家庭总和,而安杰伊和特洛伊所倡导的,是为所有人服务的经济模式——这正是民众的共鸣点所在。

玛格丽特·布伦南:在密歇根州,民主党内部存在一些持续的分歧,围绕参议院候选人阿卜杜勒·赛义德展开。周末期间,她与众议员海莉·史蒂文斯产生了争执。史蒂文斯虽然输掉了初选,但至今仍公开表示对支持赛义德深感疑虑,理由是担心赛义德的广告以及他对以色列的立场。到目前为止,民主党是否过于分裂,难以在密歇根州获胜?是不是自己阻碍了自己?

桑德斯参议员:不,我认为海莉·史蒂文斯输掉的是一场非常胶着的初选,我能理解她为此感到失望。但我要说,选举前的这两天,密歇根州各地民众都清楚,这场可能是美国历史上最重要的中期选举——因为我们要对抗的是美国有史以来最危险的总统,一个奉行威权主义、不信仰宪法或法治、要给亿万富翁大规模减税、要让1500万民众失去医保、甚至在伊朗发动非法违宪战争的人。所以密歇根州民众明白,我们或许在这个或那个问题上与阿卜杜勒存在分歧,但据我所见,全州各地的民众都站出来,支持阿卜杜勒,对抗那个只会成为特朗普政府橡皮图章的迈克·罗杰斯。

玛格丽特·布伦南:好的,我想澄清一下:海莉·史蒂文斯一直批评与阿卜杜勒·赛义德相关的广告,称那些并非他本人的广告,但她仍在就此批评他。

桑德斯参议员:没错,而且他和那些广告毫无关系。

玛格丽特·布伦南:对。

桑德斯参议员:但玛格丽特,我上周去了密歇根州——

玛格丽特·布伦南:是的。

桑德斯参议员:我得说,如果你去看密歇根州的那些广告,我这辈子都没见过这么恶心、种族主义、煽动恐惧的广告。他们指责身为医生的阿卜杜勒·赛义德是恐怖分子、圣战分子,说的全是极其恶心的话。任何共和党人支持这种恶劣广告的行为,都是一种耻辱。

玛格丽特·布伦南:这番言论确实过激。如果阿卜杜勒·赛义德获胜,他将成为美国首位任职的穆斯林参议员。不过他被指控与被称为“穆斯林兄弟会”的逊尼派伊斯兰组织有联系,他本人已与该组织划清界限并公开否认。我想为观众播放一段内容:德克萨斯州的克鲁兹参议员警告称,如果赛义德获胜,不应让他接触机密情报。听听这段录音。

[录音开始]

特德·克鲁兹:如果我认为他是穆斯林兄弟会的热情支持者,那确实存在美国人因此丧生的现实风险。

唐纳德·特朗普总统:密歇根州不需要站在恐怖分子一边的参议员。

伯尼·莫雷诺:这个叫阿卜杜勒·赛义德的人绝不能进入华盛顿特区。你觉得他明白我们的权利来自全能的上帝,耶稣是为我们的救赎而来的吗?

[录音结束]

玛格丽特·布伦南:参议员,你觉得如果参议院同事都这么尖酸刻薄,赛义德真的能顺利执政吗?

桑德斯参议员:我得说,克鲁兹、特朗普、万斯等人的言论实在令人作呕。说真的,我不在乎你是否不同意阿卜杜勒的观点——他支持全民医保,支持对亿万富翁征税,就算你在这些问题上与他意见相左,也无可厚非。但这种公然、赤裸裸的种族主义,坦白说令人作呕,应该让每一个有良知的美国人感到愤慨。事实上,阿卜杜勒的竞选活动非常出色,我认为他将在密歇根州取得一场漂亮的胜利,民众会反抗这种丑恶行径。

玛格丽特·布伦南:感谢你在种族主义问题上的明确表态。我想指出,一些美国人将任何对向以色列提供援助的批评,以及候选人所用的言论都视为反犹太主义仇恨,他们认为这是转移焦点的做法。你如何回应?

桑德斯参议员:对我来说,这有点个人化。我是犹太人,我父亲的家族被希特勒灭绝了。反犹太主义是20世纪造成数百万人死亡的极端危险的意识形态,我们绝不能容忍反犹太主义。但现实是,现在以色列是内塔尼亚胡领导的右翼极端主义政府,在我看来,也在许多专家看来,这个政府对巴勒斯坦人民实施了种族灭绝。批评以色列的这个种族主义极端主义政府,主张美国纳税人不应该花一毛钱支持这个政府,这不是反犹太主义,这是在攻击一个右翼政府,对世界上任何其他政府我也会这么说。这并不反映该国人民所信奉的宗教的性质。

玛格丽特·布伦南:明白了。

桑德斯参议员:所以我反对这种说法。批评内塔尼亚胡并不等于反犹太主义。

玛格丽特·布伦南:明白了。我想问你关于下一届国会的问题。丹·沙利文参议员今天告诉CNN,他将接受阿拉斯加联邦参议院选举的结果。而司法部长表示可能会对选举结果提出质疑。我们已经听到蒙大拿州的共和党参议员蒂姆·希伊称,“对阿拉斯加人民实施了欺诈,如果玛丽·佩尔托拉在以欺诈方式获胜,绝不能让她任职。”正如你所知,她声称自己对民主党在阿拉斯加操纵选票、伤害现任议员的计划毫不知情,不过一位助手告诉《纽约时报》,这位候选人实际上确实知情。核心问题是:如果佩尔托拉获胜,你认为参议院会怎么做?这一系列混乱是否真的损害了民主党在选举公正性问题上占据的道德高地?

桑德斯参议员:说实话,我觉得民主党在阿拉斯加的所作所为看起来挺愚蠢的,但这并不是非法行为,而是每次选举都会发生的情况。现在俄亥俄州有一位竞选者,据我了解——我和他不熟,他自称是社会主义者,没问题。而共和党超级政治行动委员会正投入资金支持他竞选。那么为什么在俄亥俄州,一个右派共和党超级政治行动委员会要资助一个社会主义者?答案很显然。他们想把选票从谢罗德·布朗那里分流走。这是好事吗?不,这不是好事,这很愚蠢——

玛格丽特·布伦南:应该对此进行调查吗?

桑德斯参议员:阿拉斯加发生的事情——

玛格丽特·布伦南:——关于阿拉斯加的?

桑德斯参议员:不,联邦政府不应该插手地方选举。而你们有一位总统,他拒不承认2020年败给拜登的选举结果。让他来决定什么是公正的选举,多少有点荒唐。阿拉斯加民众可以自己做出决定。

玛格丽特·布伦南:好的,感谢伯尼·桑德斯参议员今天抽出时间。

November 1, 2026 / 1:13 PM EST / CBS News

The following is the transcript of the interview with Sen. Bernie Sanders, Independent of Vermont, that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on Nov. 1, 2026.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Good morning, and welcome to Face the Nation. We are just hours away from voters in 50 states going to the polls for an election that could shift the balance of power here in Washington. We begin with someone who has been on the campaign trail quite a bit, although he is not up for reelection. That’s Vermont Independent Senator Bernie Sanders, who joins us from Burlington. Good morning to you, Senator.

SENATOR BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): Good morning.

MARGARET BRENNAN: I’ve been told you’ve hosted telerallies, town halls for Maine and Michigan this weekend. Troy Jackson, Abdul El-Sayed. You’re focused as well on Florida and Minnesota. Why Florida, since it is likely GOP according to CBS numbers, and CBS also rates Minnesota as likely Dem. Why focus there?

SEN. SANDERS: Well, I don’t take anything for granted. I think Angie Nixon in Florida is running a great grassroots campaign. She pulled off a huge upset in the Democratic primary. I think she has a real chance to win the general election. She is mobilizing working-class people all over this country, and she’s talking about the right issues. And those issues are true in Minnesota. They’re true in Florida. They’re true in Vermont. People are disgusted and frustrated with an economy in which the billionaires have never ever had it so good. Elon Musk now owns more wealth alone than the bottom 53% of American households, while millions of people today are struggling to put food on the table, pay for, you know, pay to fill up their gas tanks, pay for rent. So what Angie is talking about, what Troy is talking about is an economy that works for all. That’s resonating.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, out in Michigan, there appears some inner Democratic Party squabbles that are ongoing here around the Senate candidate Abdul El-Sayed. There was a back and forth over the weekend with Congresswoman Haley Stevens. She lost the primary, but she continues to make public her deep misgivings about backing him now, citing concerns about his ads and his views on Israel. At this point, is the Democratic Party just too divided to pull off a win in Michigan? Is it getting in its own way?

SEN. SANDERS: No, I think- No, I think the over, you know, Haley Stevens lost a very, very close primary. I can understand being upset about that, but I think two days before the election, where people all over Michigan understand that this is the most important midterm election, perhaps in the history of the United States, because we are taking on the most dangerous president that we’ve ever had, somebody who’s an authoritarian, does not believe in the Constitution or the rule of law, who wants to give massive tax breaks to billionaires, throw 15 million people off their health care, that they had started an illegal, unconstitutional war in Iran. So, what the people in Michigan understand, sure, we have disagreements with Abdul on this or that issue, but from what I can see, all over the state people are standing up. They’re going to stand with Abdul, take on somebody who will be nothing more than a rubber stamp for the Trump administration. That’s Mike Rogers.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay, just want to clarify there Haley Stevens has been criticizing ads associated and endorsing Abdul Sayed [sic] that he has said are- are not his ads, but she’s still criticizing him for them.

SEN. SANDERS: Right. But, I–

MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah go ahead.

SEN. SANDERS: Right, and he had nothing to do with those ads.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.

SEN. SANDERS: But Margaret, I was in Michigan last week–

MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.

SEN. SANDERS: –and I got to tell you, if you want to look at ads in Michigan, I have never in my life seen such disgusting, racist, fearmongering ads as those that are taking place in Michigan right now. They are calling Abdul El-Sayed, who is a medical doctor, they’re calling him a terrorist, a jihadist, really disgusting things. And the- the fact that any Republican would stand behind those horrible ads is a disgrace.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, the rhetoric is extraordinary. El-Sayed would be America’s first sitting Muslim senator if he pulls off a win here. He has been accused, though, of ties to a Sunni Islamist group known as the mother- Muslim Brotherhood. He has distanced himself. He has disavowed it. But I want to play for our viewers something. Senator Cruz of Texas warned against El-Sayed being given any access to classified intelligence if he wins. Listen.

[BEGIN SOUND ON TAPE]

TED CRUZ: And if I am correct that he is a passionate supporter of the Muslim Brotherhood, there is a very real risk that Americans will die as a result.

PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: Michigan does not need a senator who’s on the side of the terrorists.

BERNIE MORENO: This character Abdul El-Sayed can be nowhere near Washington D.C. Do you think he understands that concept that our rights come from God Almighty? That Jesus came here for our salvation.

[END SOUND ON TAPE]

MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator, do you think that El-Sayed could actually govern if his colleagues in the Senate are this vitriolic?

SEN. SANDERS: I mean that- I just got to say, what Cruz and Trump and Vance and others are saying is disgusting. It really is. And again, I don’t care if you disagree with Abdul- he believes in Medicare for all, he believes in taxing billionaires. Fine, you disagree with him on that, that’s fine. But that level of racism, overt, absolute racism, is frankly disgusting and should appall every decent American. The fact of the matter is that Abdul is running an extraordinary campaign, and I think what you’re going to see is a good victory in Michigan for him. People will rebel against that type of ugliness.

MARGARET BRENNAN: I appreciate your clarity when it comes to racism. I do want to point out that some Americans hear any criticism of sending aid to Israel and the words that the candidate has used as anti-Jewish hate, and they believe that that’s scapegoating as well. How do you respond to that?

SEN. SANDERS: Well, you know, for me, it’s a little bit personal. I am Jewish. My father’s family was wiped out by Hitler. Anti-Semitism is an extraordinarily disgusting and dangerous ideology that has killed millions and millions of lives in the last century. We cannot tolerate anti-Semitism period. But the reality is that right now in Israel you have a right-wing extremist government led by Netanyahu, who, in my view, and the view of many experts, has in fact committed genocide against the Palestinian people. To be critical of a racist extremist government in Israel, and to say that American taxpayers should not spend a nickel supporting that government is not anti-Semitism, it is attacking a right-wing government, and I would say the same about any other government on earth. Does not reflect the nature of the religion of the people who are in that country.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Got it.

SEN. SANDERS: So I reject that. You can criticize Netanyahu, and you’re not anti-Semitic.

MARGARET BRENNAN: Got it. I want to ask you about the next Congress. Senator Dan Sullivan told CNN today that he will accept the results in the Alaska U.S. Senate race, the certification of which the Justice Department has said it may challenge. But we’re already hearing from Republican Senator Tim Sheehy of Montana, that there “was fraud perpetrated against the people of Alaska, and under no circumstances should Mary Peltola be seated if she wins in a fraudulent manner.” She argues, as you know, she has no knowledge of this Democratic effort to stack the ballot in Alaska from- and to hurt the incumbent, though an aide told the New York Times that the candidate did indeed know. Bottom line: What do you expect the Senate to do if she wins? And does all this mess really hurt the Democratic argument that they have a moral high ground on election integrity?

SEN. SANDERS: Yeah, frankly, what the Democrats did in Alaska seems to me to be pretty dumb, but it goes- this is- it’s not illegal. It’s what happens in every election. Right now in Ohio, there is a gentleman who is running, who is, as I understand it, don’t know him, claiming to be a socialist, fine. And Republican Super PAC is putting money into his election. So why in Ohio is a Republican, a right-wing super PAC, funding a socialist? The answer is obviously- obvious. They want to take votes away from Sherrod Brown. Is this a good thing to do? No, it is not a good thing to do. It’s a stupid thing to do–

MARGARET BRENNAN: Should there be an investigation–

SEN. SANDERS: –What’s going on in Alaska is–

MARGARET BRENNAN: –of Alaska?

SEN. SANDERS: No, that’s the decision- The federal government does not get involved in state elections. And you have a president who, in fact, denied that he lost the election in 2020 against Biden. For him to be deciding what is a fair election or not is a little bit absurd. People of Alaska can make that decision themselves.

MARGARET BRENNAN: All right, Senator Bernie Sanders, thank you very much for your time today.

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