2026-07-12T14:09:16-0400 / 哥伦比亚广播公司新闻
以下是俄亥俄州共和党众议员迈克·特纳的采访实录，该采访于2026年7月12日在《与玛格丽特·布伦南直面国家》节目中播出。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我们现在邀请到了俄亥俄州共和党众议员迈克·特纳。很高兴您能做客，议员先生。我知道您是乌克兰的朋友，格雷厄姆参议员当然也是。正如我刚才提到的，他终于能推动这项制裁和关税法案时非常兴奋。您认为没有他这样的支持者，这项法案还能推进吗？
众议员迈克·特纳： 嗯，我们只能寄希望于，正如您刚才所说，这将是他留下的一项政治遗产——参议院能够通过他提出的这项法案。你知道吗，上周我和林赛·格雷厄姆以及另一位参议员——沙欣参议员、库恩斯、德宾、朗兹——一起参加了北约峰会，我们和泽连斯基会面时，林赛·格雷厄姆强调了这项制裁法案的必要性。这项法案已经在众议院通过，我也是共同提案人之一，而且应该在参议院通过，林赛一直是这项法案的坚定支持者。这就是他提出的法案。你知道，失去林赛令人非常难过，因为在当下这场“美国优先”的辩论中——你可以做到“美国优先”，同时明白不必单打独斗。盟友们需要美国的声音。美国的声音很重要。美国需要站出来捍卫自由、民主和 liberty（自由）。而这正是林赛·格雷厄姆的声音所代表的。你知道，从麦凯恩的声音到里根的声音，人们在林赛身上看到的是一个敢于站出来说“你并不孤单，美国与你同在”的人。我们不会为你去做这件事，我们不会进来替你做决定。但——但你不会是孤军奋战。而他就是乌克兰的那个声音，他刚去过乌克兰，说我们会与你同在，这项法案将是一个重要的象征，表明“我们会与乌克兰站在一起”。我当然希望参议院本周就能通过这项法案，让它在本周内送到总统的办公桌上。正如您刚才所说，他之前和您联系过，说他相信白宫已经对这项法案表示支持。我们应该通过这项法案，将它送到总统的办公桌上。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 您知道共和党领导层目前是否考虑过这一点吗？
众议员特纳： 我——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 好的。
众议员特纳：——我知道，你知道，我们刚从北约峰会回来时就有消息称，他们认为——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 没错。
众议员特纳：——他们可以在参议院推动这项法案。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 没错。
众议员特纳： 众议院已经通过了这项法案的一个版本——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 没错。
众议员特纳：——所以我知道有广泛的支持。你知道，有超过——嗯，足以推翻总统否决的参议员人数——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 没错，85名参议员——
众议员特纳：——共同提案支持这项法案。有了白宫的支持，这项法案本周就能送到总统的办公桌上。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我还想问您关于北约的问题。您多年前投票支持了一项法案，我们称之为《以制裁反击美国敌人法案》（CAATSA），该法案旨在应对土耳其购买俄罗斯武器系统的行为。而本周特朗普总统表示，他同意解除部分制裁，让土耳其继续采购F-35战斗机。这怎么可能发生，又不违反您曾支持的法律呢？
众议员特纳： 没错。您说的是S-400防空系统，也就是土耳其购买的俄罗斯防空——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是的。
众议员特纳：——系统，在那个时期，国会通过了一项法案并签署成为法律，该法案将限制总统——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是在特朗普第一任期内。
众议员特纳： 没错。——解除对土耳其的制裁，包括将其排除在F-35项目之外。现在土耳其已经表示，他们现在有意愿遵守该法案，这意味着S-400将不再成为他们重新加入F-35项目的障碍。我当然希望这能成真。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 他们会把S-400卖给其他国家吗？
众议员特纳： 相关信息，你知道——我不能透露他们私下告诉我们的内容，但这非常有希望。所有参议员都一致同意，我们可以公开表示我们听到的消息非常乐观，沙欣参议员也说过——她是这项法案的最初起草者之一，她认为此事很有希望。如果他们做到这一点，让他们重新加入F-35项目将极其重要。他们是北约成员国，是非常强大的北约成员，当然，他们刚刚主办了这次非常成功的峰会。我当然希望他们能信守承诺，以这种方式回归该项目。他们也曾是F-35零部件的生产商，所以重新加入生产将非常、非常重要。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我还想问您一些国内事务的问题。上周五，国土安全部宣布，他们将要求各州改变选举运作方式，如果各州拒绝，将损失数百万美元的联邦反恐资金。其中包括改用纸质选票，而目前几乎每个州都有纸质备份系统。您如何看待这种迫使各州改变选举制度的联邦压力？
众议员特纳： 没错，所以我其实不太了解这个公告。你知道，显然国会有人担心联邦政府干预选举——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 作为一名保守派，您肯定会有这种担忧。没错。
众议员特纳：——在州一级。但与此同时，也存在——或者说“美国优先”，你知道的——你知道的，众议院正在推进的法案中的条款，这些条款旨在确保我们要求选民提供身份证明，以证明他们是美国公民，以及邮寄选票，正如总统在他的提案中提出的那样。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 没错。
众议员特纳：——他一直在——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 他想要改变所有这些事情。
众议员特纳： 所有这些事情都令人担忧，我们当然必须加以解决。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 现在距离中期选举还有多少天？在这个时间点做出这种改变其实并不现实——
众议员特纳： 众议院已经多次通过这些条款，所有这些我都投了赞成票——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我们注意到了。我们确实核实过这一点。
众议员特纳：——我认为——我认为参议院确实需要推进这些条款。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 但你在明知参议院没有足够票数使其成为法律的情况下还是投了赞成票？投赞成票，却希望它通不过？
众议员特纳： 我认为——我认为——总统正在——当然是在就这些条款如何需要——成为法律进行非常有力的论证，而且我认为这些条款将确保美国民众了解选举——投票中的诚信。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 好吧，非公民不能在联邦选举中投票，这在1996年就已经成为一项规定——
众议员特纳： 问题在于你如何确保——这种情况确实——正在发生——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 这一点每个州都在做。
众议员特纳： 我们需要确保我们能确保这种情况确实发生。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 在州一级？
众议员特纳： 你知道，当然——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我让您继续说这个话题。不过，只是——
众议员特纳： 当然，提供身份证明至少应该是，确保——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是的，但不是——
众议员特纳：——我们知道谁在投票。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是的。
[插话重叠]
众议员特纳： 我们如何——我们如何？我的意思是，有太多事情——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 好吧，各州会核实这一点。而且并不是所有驾照都会注明你是公民。
众议员特纳：——你必须提供身份证明。你怎么能——怎么能让某人投票，却连身份证明都不需要？我无法理解怎么会有人反对这一点。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 让我——
众议员特纳： 这是其中一件离谱的事情。美国民众认为人们应该——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是的。
众议员特纳：——拥有身份证明才能投票。这应该能通过。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 是的，而且——这通常在登记投票时就需要了。非常快地问一下，您知道俄亥俄州斯普林菲尔德市那些临时保护身份将被取消的海地人的处理计划是什么吗？
众议员特纳： 截至周五，已经有了短期延期，原因是——
玛格丽特·布伦南： 也就是7月24日。
众议员特纳： 超过——两周。你知道，马克韦恩·马林斯部长表示，那些正在工作的个人——他们应该考虑——作为一种方式，他们可能被纳入其他程序，因为，你知道，他们当然对社会做出了贡献。你知道，我们的州长迈克·德瓦恩和我本人以及其他在我们社区中有受影响人员的人，当然都倡导这些个人能够留在我们的社区，他们在工作并做出贡献。他们是我们社区中宝贵的人才，我们当然希望——
[插话重叠]
玛格丽特·布伦南： 你曾投票支持国会延长这一身份，但领导层——
众议员特纳：——我们当然希望他们能够——他们能够留下来，并且——能够继续为我们的社区做出贡献。
玛格丽特·布伦南： 我们将继续追踪这一情况，以及他们在7月24日之后是否还有这样的希望。议员先生，感谢您抽出时间。我们稍后回来。
Transcript: Rep. Mike Turner on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan,” July 12, 2026
2026-07-12T14:09:16-0400 / CBS News
The following is the transcript of an interview with Republican Rep. Mike Turner of Ohio that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on July 12, 2026.
MARGARET BRENNAN: And we’re joined now by Ohio Republican Congressman Mike Turner. It is good to have you here, Congressman. I know you are a friend to Ukraine. Senator Graham certainly was. As I mentioned, he was so excited about finally getting to move this sanctions and tariffs bill. Do you think that this will go forward without a champion like him behind it?
REPRESENTATIVE MIKE TURNER: Well, let’s hope. Let’s hope, as you had- had indicated, that- that- that is one of the legacies that- that the Senate will move his bill. You know, we were- I was at the NATO summit with Lindsey Graham and another senator last- last week, Senator Shaheen, Coons, Durbin, Rounds, and as we met with Zelenskyy, Lindsey Graham was making the point of the need for this sanctions bill that has passed the House and that I’ve co-sponsored, and that- that should pass the Senate, that Lindsey has been such a champion for. It was his- it was his bill. You know, what’s so sad about losing Lindsey is that, you know, in this debate now that we have of America first- you can be America first and still understand that it doesn’t have to be America alone. That, you know, allies want America’s voice. America’s voice is important. America needs to stand for- for freedom and- and democracy and liberty. And that’s what they saw in the voice of- of Lindsey Graham. You know, in McCain’s voice and Reagan’s voice, and what- what they saw in Lindsey was someone who was willing to stand up and say, “You’re not alone. America is with you.” You know, we’re not going to do it for you. We’re not going to- you know come in and decide for you. But- but you’re not going to be alone. And- and he was that voice with Ukraine, having just gone to Ukraine, saying we’re- we’re going to be with you, and this bill would be an important symbolism to say ‘we’re going to be with Ukraine.’ And I certainly hope the Senate moves it this week, and we can put it on the president’s desk this week. As you had said earlier, he had been in touch with you and said he believed he had movement from the White House for that bill. We should pass this bill, put it on the president’s desk.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Do you know if Republican leadership has considered that at all at this point?
REP. TURNER: I don’t–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Okay.
REP. TURNER: –I know that, you know, we certainly have the news where they had just said upon our–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
REP. TURNER: –return from the NATO summit that they believed–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
REP. TURNER:–that they could move this in the Senate.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
REP. TURNER: The House has already passed a version of this bill–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
REP. TURNER: So I know there’s broad support. There were, you know, more than a- you know veto-proof number of senators–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah, 85 in the–
REP. TURNER:–who co-sponsored it. With the White House’s support, this bill could be on the president’s desk this week.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Let me ask you as well about NATO. You had voted for a bill years ago, CAATSA, we’ll call it, that would challenge what Turkey had done, which was buy this Russian weapons system, and President Trump said this week that he’s okay with lifting some of the sanctions and letting Turkey have the F-35 fighter. How could that happen and not violate the law that you supported?
REP. TURNER: Right. So you’re speaking of the S-400s, which is the Russian air defense–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
REP. TURNER:–system that that Turkey had purchased, and during that time, Congress had passed, which had been signed into law, a bill that would restrict the the president’s ability–
MARGARET BRENNAN: In the first Trump administration.
REP. TURNER: Right. And to- to waive sanctions that were placed on Turkey, including it had taken them out of the F-35 program. The- Turkey has signaled that they are now in a position that they want to comply with the- with that bill that would put them in a position where the S-400 would no longer be an impediment to their entering back into the F-35 program. I certainly hope that that occurs.
MARGARET BRENNAN: They’ll sell it to somebody else?
REP. TURNER: The information, you know- I can’t disclose what they had told to us, but it’s very promising. Of all the senators, we agreed together that we would be able to publicly say what we heard was very promising, and Senator Shaheen has said- you know, she was one of the original authors of this, she believes it’s promising. If they do this, and to get them back in the F-35 program is incredibly important. They’re a member of NATO, a very strong member of NATO, having just, of course, hosted the summit, which was very successful. I certainly hope that they follow through and that they do so in a manner that returns them. They were also a producer of parts for the F-35, so entering back into production would be very, very important.
MARGARET BRENNAN: I want to ask you about some other things on the domestic front as well. Late Friday, Homeland Security made an announcement that they’re going to change- they want states to change the way that elections are conducted, or if states refuse, they’ll lose millions in federal terrorism prevention funds. So, there are a list of things in there, including switching to paper ballots, which, like, nearly every single state has a paper backup system at this point. What do you think of this federal pressure to get states to change their elections?
REP. TURNER: Right, so I’m not really familiar with this announcement. You know, obviously there is concern in Congress of federal intervention on the election–
MARGARET BRENNAN: As a conservative, you must. Yeah.
REP. TURNER: –on the state side. But at the same time, there is also- or America First, you know the- you know the- the provisions of the bills that are moving through the House that relate to ensuring that we have identification for people to- to prove that they’re American citizens, mail ballots as the president has made as a portion of his provisions
MARGARET BRENNAN: Right.
REP. TURNER:–that he’s continues to–
MARGARET BRENNAN: He wants to change all these things.
REP. TURNER: All of those things are of concern, and certainly we have to address them.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You’re how many days until the midterm elections? At this point, that’s not really practical–
REP. TURNER: The House has passed these provisions several times, all of which I have voted for–
MARGARET BRENNAN: We noticed that. We did check that.
REP. TURNER: –I think- I think the Senate does need to move these provisions.
MARGARET BRENNAN: But did you vote for it, knowing that the Senate doesn’t have the votes to actually make it become law? Vote yes, hope no?
REP. TURNER: I think- I think- I think the president is- is certainly making a very good case as to how these provisions need to- to become law, and I think that they are ones that will ensure for the American public, you know, integrity in the- in voting.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, non-citizens can’t vote in federal elections. That became one 1996–
REP. TURNER: The concern is how do you ensure that- that’s going- that that is occurring–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Which each state does.
REP. TURNER: And we need to make certain that we ensure that that occurs.
MARGARET BRENNAN: At the state level?
REP. TURNER: You know, certainly–
MARGARET BRENNAN: I’ll let you go on that. But, just to–
REP. TURNER: Certainly having- having identification should be at least, the way to ensure–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes, but not–
REP. TURNER: –that someone- that we know who’s voting.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yes.
[CROSSTALK]
REP. TURNER: How do we- how do we have? I mean, there are so many things–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well the states verify it. And not all drivers license say you are a citizen.
REP. TURNER: –that you have to have identification for. How do you- how do you let someone vote and not even have an identification? I can’t understand how anyone would be opposed to that.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Let me–
REP. TURNER: And this is one of those things where it’s- it’s off the charts. The American public believe that people should–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
REP. TURNER: –have identification to vote. This should pass.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah, and- and that’s often required when you register. Very quickly, do you know what the plan is to deal with the Haitians who are having their temporary protected status revoked in Springfield, Ohio?
REP. TURNER: So as of Friday, there’s been a short-term extension because of the–
MARGARET BRENNAN: So the 24th of July.
REP. TURNER: It’s over- two weeks. You know, the- Markwayne Mullin, Secretary has said that those individuals who are working- that they should look to- as manner in which they might be able to be included in other processes, because, you know, they’re contributing to society certainly. You know our governor Mike DeWine and myself and others who have individuals in our community who are going to be affected, are certainly advocates for these individuals to be able to stay in our communities, who are working and contributing. They’re valuable people in our community, and we certainly hope–
[CROSSTALK]
MARGARET BRENNAN: You voted for Congress to extend this, but leadership–
REP. TURNER: –we certainly hope that they can- that they can stay and- and be able to contribute into our communities.
MARGARET BRENNAN: We’re going to continue to- to track that and whether they have that hope beyond the 24th of July. Congressman, thank you for your time. We’ll be back in a moment.