2026年11月15日 美国东部时间下午12:16 / CBS新闻
以下是2026年11月15日路易斯安那州共和党参议员比尔·卡西迪做客《玛格丽特·布伦南面对面》节目的访谈实录。
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玛格丽特·布伦南：现在我们连线参议院卫生、教育、劳工与养老金委员会主席、来自路易斯安那州的共和党参议员比尔·卡西迪。早上好，医生。
比尔·卡西迪参议员：早上好。
玛格丽特·布伦南：你可能已经看到了相关报道，我们的合作伙伴凯撒家庭基金会（KFF）指出，美国正式失去了麻疹消除国家的地位。你也知道，婴儿要到一岁左右才会接种麻疹疫苗，这意味着麻疹在美国持续传播，可能会让父母面临孩子被感染的风险，在这样的寒冷天气里，他们几乎无能为力来保护孩子。你认为现任卫生官员在向公众宣传传播风险方面做得足够吗？
卡西迪参议员：首先，我要强调你刚才说的话。作为一名医生，我想说，你可以基于个人意愿选择不接种疫苗，但那些还太小、无法接种疫苗的孩子，如果和你接触就会面临风险，我们已经出现了因麻疹死亡的幼儿，他们根本没到接种年龄。顺便说一下，免疫功能低下的人群也是如此，比如孕妇的免疫力下降，或者正在接受化疗的癌症患者。所以如果你没有接种疫苗，就可能成为夺走他人生命的人——这一点一定要记住。
至于你问的公共卫生官员是否做得足够？我想如果我是总统，我会站在山顶上发出这个信息：你可以说这是你自己的身体，想怎么做就怎么做，但你不能把麻疹或其他疾病传染给还没到接种年龄的孩子。我认为这才应该是要传达的信息，而且要反复强调，不停强调。
玛格丽特·布伦南：你负责监督这些卫生机构，在接下来的几周里，你计划采取行动吗？比如，为什么我们听不到美国疾控中心（CDC）主任的声音？
卡西迪参议员：我和CDC主任一直保持着定期联系。比如有一个链接出现了故障，人们输入自己的邮政编码就能找到接种流感疫苗的地点，结果那个链接坏了。有人告诉我这个情况后，我给她发了短信。她很快回复说自己不知道这件事，会去调查。后来她又发短信说，这个故障已经存在一年了，她正在着手修复。还有很多事情需要解决，施瓦茨博士（Dr. Schwartz）尽了最大努力。但关于这件事还会有更多评论。我们剩下的时间不多了——没有，大概还有四周，所以公开听证会的时间有限——
玛格丽特·布伦南：是的。
卡西迪参议员：但我们在幕后一直在沟通。
玛格丽特·布伦南：嗯，你之前告诉过我们，你投票确认肯尼迪部长时，认为他会以参议院确认的身份加强监督，你还说他辜负了你的承诺。本周，肯尼迪部长表示，过去参议院共和党人会威胁不批准他的任命，但现在民主党将成为多数党，他也不再束手束脚了。一起来听一下。
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美国卫生与公众服务部部长小罗伯特·F·肯尼迪：参议院对我已经没有任何约束力了，这一点很重要。然后我们把斯蒂芬·米勒招来，他是我们阵营的朋友。我觉得现在什么都阻挡不了我们了。
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玛格丽特·布伦南：“参议院对我已经没有任何约束力了”，你怎么看这句话？
卡西迪参议员：首先，他显然是在为自己担任卫生与公众服务部部长的失败找借口。他本应在超加工食品问题上采取积极措施，这是“MAHA妈妈”们所期望的。但进展甚微，现在我们又失去了麻疹消除国家的地位，还有婴儿死于麻疹。所以，如果你是一名“MAHA妈妈”，原本期望能有更好的结果——有数百名“MAHA妈妈”在辩论期间联系过我，询问是否支持这位卫生与公众服务部部长——她们的期望就是如此，完全有理由失望。而他所说的，因为过去共和党人在参议院，现在民主党掌权，他的工作会更容易，这种说法根本站不住脚。这不过是在为一系列的失败找借口。顺便说一下，医疗保健支出正水涨船高，越来越多的小企业放弃提供医保，员工连自付额都承担不起。这就是工作的失败。如果我是总统，我会换个人，因为需要为医疗成本上涨、麻疹死亡病例增加、失去消除麻疹的地位，以及在超加工食品问题上毫无进展这些事负责。
玛格丽特·布伦南：所以，包括阿尔索布鲁克斯参议员和沃诺克参议员在内的多位民主党人表示，小罗伯特·F·肯尼迪（RFK）必须辞职或被解雇。即将上任的参议员之一、来自南卡罗来纳州的安妮·安德鲁斯医生，她的竞选纲领就是弹劾RFK。之前我问你是否考虑过这种可能性，你当时说不认为存在可弹劾的罪行。现在还是这样吗？
卡西迪参议员：这最终是总统的决定，弹劾归根结底是总统的遗产。至于弹劾，我想，就算因为一份火腿三明治都能弹劾，所以大家得决定怎么做。但我更认为，这是总统的决定。如果总统想要的遗产是医疗成本上涨、失去麻疹消除地位、在解决超加工食品等问题上毫无进展，那这份遗产会有损总统形象。如果总统想要一些真正积极的成果，就应该换人。从政治角度来说，美国选民在中期选举中已经表明，他们不喜欢现状，尤其是在医疗保健方面，我认为现在是时候做出改变了。
玛格丽特·布伦南：所以共和党正赶在民主党1月就职前完成提名的确认工作，本周三就将对总统提名的FDA局长候选人海蒂·奥弗顿博士进行投票。你之前说过，她在特朗普政府制定儿童疫苗政策中的角色几乎是“无法通过确认的”。柯林斯参议员对FDA批准调味电子烟和尼古丁产品表示担忧，穆尔科斯基参议员则担心FDA科学审查和批准堕胎药物米非司酮时面临政治压力。考虑到这些，你仍然预计你的委员会会批准奥弗顿博士吗？
卡西迪参议员：我不确定。我这周一直在打电话，和奥弗顿博士本人以及其他人都谈过。我还有一些疑问，所以现在还无法告诉你投票结果。但我已经和四位或五位共和党参议员同事谈过了，也继续和我的顾问们讨论。所以我还不能给出答案。
玛格丽特·布伦南：所以你可能会在没有参议院确认的FDA局长的情况下结束这一切，这会让你担心吗？
卡西迪参议员：是的，这就是问题所在，玛格丽特。大家总说“天哪，我们难道不想追求完美吗？”但我们得不到完美。所以问题变成，我们是想要一系列短期的行政官员，可能更容易受到部长的影响，还是想要一个虽不是在大家心中完美，但至少是永久任职的人，能够建立一些独立性。这就是我考虑的一方面，当然其他事情也会有影响。我也收到了很多来自在FDA工作有重要影响力、深思熟虑的人的看法，他们认为保持稳定的工作状态更好；还有其他人持不同意见。所以这件事仍在反复权衡，我们周三就能知道结果。
玛格丽特·布伦南：我们来看看你周三的投票结果。正如你所说，年底前剩下的工作日非常有限，准确来说是20个工作日，你有很多事要做，包括国防拨款、政府拨款，看起来还有政府停摆的风险。你说特朗普总统和参议院多数党领袖约翰·图恩已经向你承诺会处理社会保障问题，你真的能在这20个工作日内完成所有这些重要工作吗？
卡西迪参议员：我从图恩和迈克·克拉波那里都得到了承诺，会就社会保障法案举行听证会和标记审议。法案可以是我的，也可以是其他人的。总统本人也向我个人承诺会支持法案，他的团队提供了很大帮助。我也得到了民主党人的支持。这是一项两党合作的法案。参议院财政委员会的资深成员罗恩·怀登决定不配合，我对他说，怀登参议员，不一定非要是我的法案，任何法案都可以，但他不想配合。所以除非他改变主意，否则我们可能不会举行听证会，这很遗憾，因为我们本来有能力在参议院获得60票支持，众议院也能通过，总统会签署法案，可他就是不想合作。社会保障就像一个孩子，它刚开始生病的时候就必须好好照顾它，而现在社会保障已经生病很长时间了。作为国家、作为政府，我们必须照顾它，我觉得这份照顾被忽视了。非常令人沮丧，但情况就是这样。
玛格丽特·布伦南：没错，社会保障将在六年内耗尽资金，医疗保险差不多也是如此，可你却没有——
卡西迪参议员：这就是为什么我们现在就应该行动。顺便说一下，怀登参议员不喜欢我的计划，因为我们要借1.5万亿美元，把它存入社会保障信托基金之外的投资基金，投入更广泛的经济中，让它在六十年内增长，最终能支付社会保障所需资金的70%。他不想把税款投入股市。他之前这么做过，几乎在小布什政府时期，他就为联邦铁路退休系统投票支持过完全相同的政策，而且效果非常好，确实行之有效。所以我觉得这是一个借口。顺便说一下，我还提议把伯尼·桑德斯的法案也拿出来讨论，我们可以这么做，但就是有人拒绝参与。我太生气了，这对我们国家太重要了。国会的职责是做出艰难的选择，而现在我们却在回避这些选择。
玛格丽特·布伦南：参议员，感谢你今天上午抽出时间，我们会继续报道这件事，稍后再见。
Transcript: Sen. Bill Cassidy on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan,” Nov. 15, 2026
November 15, 2026 / 12:16 PM EST / CBS News
The following is the transcript of the interview with Sen. Bill Cassidy, Republican of Louisiana, that aired on “Face the Nation with Margaret Brennan” on Nov. 15, 2026.
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MARGARET BRENNAN: We go now to the chairman of the Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions, Republican Senator Bill Cassidy of Louisiana. Good morning to you, Doctor.
SEN. BILL CASSIDY: Good morning.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You may have seen these headlines that it is now official that the U.S. has lost its status as a country where measles is eliminated, our partners at KFF report. And as you know, babies don’t get their measles shot until they’re around a year old, and so that means this regular transmission of measles throughout the country can leave parents with- with risks of exposing their kids and- and little that they can do to protect them in these cold weather months. Do you think that the current health officials are doing enough to educate the public about the risk of transmission?
SEN. CASSIDY: First, let me emphasize what you just said. Speaking as a physician, you may decide not to be vaccinated because it’s your free will, but the child who’s too young to be vaccinated is vulnerable if you come into that child’s presence, and we’re seeing children die from measles who are too young to be vaccinated. By the way, it’s also true for the immunocompromised, which might be a woman who is pregnant and her immunity falls. It might be- it might be someone on cancer chemotherapy. So if you’ve not been vaccinated, you could be the person that brings death to another. That’s something to remember. Your specific question- question, are public health officials doing enough? I think if I were president, I’d be saying, stand on the mountaintop, give that message, that you may decide that this is just your body, do what you want, but you can bring measles or some other disease into the- into the health space of a child who’s not- who’s not old enough to be vaccinated. I think that should be the message going out. It should be pounded, pounded, pounded.
MARGARET BRENNAN: You have oversight of these health institutions. In- in the next few weeks, do you plan action? I mean, why aren’t we hearing from the CDC director?
SEN. CASSIDY: So I’m in regular contact with the CDC director. For example, there was a broken link where you fill in your zip code and it tells you where to get the flu shot. And I- somebody informed me it was broken. I texted her. She responded quickly and saying that she didn’t know about it, she would look into it. And then she texted back to say it’s been broken for a year, and so she’s working to fix it. There’s a lot of things to fix, and Dr. Schwartz is, as best I can tell, doing her best. But there will be more comments about this. It is- we’ve got four to six weeks left. No, we got about four weeks left, and so there’s a limited time–
MARGARET BRENNAN: Yeah.
SEN. CASSIDY: –to have a public hearing, but there’s contact going on in the background.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, you have shared with us previously that when you voted to confirm Secretary Kennedy, you believed that he would have more oversight in that Senate confirmed position. You also said that he’s broken promises to you. This past week, Secretary Kennedy said while Senate Republicans used to threaten not to confirm his appointees, now that Democrats will be in the majority, his gloves will be off. Take a listen.
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HHS SECRETARY ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR.: The Senate no longer has any leverage over me, and you know- and that’s a big deal. And then we have Stephen Miller in, who’s a- a friend of our movement. And I don’t think anything is going to get in our way now.
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MARGARET BRENNAN: The Senate has no leverage over me. What do you make of that?
SEN. CASSIDY: Well, first, he’s obviously trying to provide cover for failure as Secretary of Health and Human Services. He was supposed to be doing something positive on ultra-processed foods. That’s what MAHA moms wanted. There’s been minimal progress, and now we’ve lost our measles elimination status, and we have infants dying from measles. So, if you’re a MAHA mom and you are hoping for something better- and hundreds of them contacted me during this debate about whether to support the secretary for HHS secretary- that’s what they wanted. They have every right to be disappointed, and the logic that because Republicans have been there, but now Democrats are in charge, will make it easier for him? There is no logic. This is about covering a series of failures. And by the way, I should also say that healthcare expenses are sky-high, going higher. Small businesses dropping coverage, employees unable to afford their deductible. This has been a failure. If I were president, I would choose someone else because there needs to be accountability for higher healthcare costs, more measles deaths, losing elimination status, and no progress on processed foods.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So, a number of Democrats, including Senator Alsobrooks and Warnock, have said RFK must resign or be fired. One of the incoming senators, Dr. Annie Andrews from South Carolina, she actually ran on a platform of impeaching RFK. When I’ve asked you in the past about that possibility, you told me you didn’t see an impeachable offense. Is that still the case?
SEN. CASSIDY: Well, it’s up to the president. This is ultimately the president’s legacy. The impeachment. As regards impeachment, you know, you can impeach, I guess, over a ham sandwich, so they’ll have to decide what to do on that. But I do think it’s more importantly the president’s decision. The president may want a legacy of higher health care costs, losing measles elimination status, and no progress on addressing ultra-processed foods and other things. If so, that’ll taint the president’s legacy. If the president wants actually something positive, he should change. And that’s just that’s just speaking politically. The American voters signaled at the midterm they don’t like status quo, particularly in healthcare, and I think it’s time for something different.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So Republicans are racing to confirm nominees before Democrats take office in January, and this Wednesday is the vote on the nomination of Dr. Heidi Overton, the president’s nominee to become the FDA commissioner. You’ve previously said her role in crafting the Trump administration’s childhood vaccine policies was almost disqualifying. Senator Collins has raised concern about the FDA’s authorization of flavored vapes and nicotine. Senator Murkowski has worried about political pressure on scientific review and the FDA-approved abortion drug mifepristone. Given all this, do you still expect that Dr. Overton will be approved by your committee?
SEN. CASSIDY: I don’t know that. I’ve been working the phones all week, both speaking with Dr. Overton, speaking with others. I still have questions, and so I cannot tell you the outcome of that vote right now. But I spoke to four or five of my down dais Republican members, as well as continuing to discuss things with my advisors. So I can’t tell you that answer yet.
MARGARET BRENNAN: So you, you may leave without a Senate confirmed FDA commissioner in place. Does that worry you?
SEN. CASSIDY: Yeah, and that’s part of it, Margaret. It’s always easy to say, “my gosh, wouldn’t we want to have perfection?” But we’re not going to have perfection. We just know that. So then the question is, do we want a series of short-term administrators who probably will have more influence from the secretary, as opposed to someone who may be not- you know the perfect candidate in somebody’s mind, but at least would be a permanent one and have the ability to establish some independence. And that’s part of the thought process there. That weighs on one side, and of course other things weigh on the other. And- and I’ve heard from a lot of people who are significant, who think deeply about the FDA, who have said it’s better to have a steady hand. I’ve heard from others that have a different opinion. So it continues to go back and forth, and we’ll know Wednesday.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, we’ll see how you vote on Wednesday. As you said, you got a limited number of days, 20 exact before the end of the year. 20 working days. You got a lot of business. There’s defense funding. There is government funding, and looks like possibly the risk of a government shutdown. You said President Trump and Senate Majority Leader John Thune have made commitments to you to address Social Security. Can you really get all that kind of serious work done in 20 working days?
SEN. CASSIDY: So I had a commitment from both Thune and from Mike Crapo to have a hearing and a markup on a Social Security bill. It could be mine, could be someone else’s, and the president actually has- has given me personal commitment that he would support it, and his administration has been very helpful. I have Democrats who are also supportive. It’s a bipartisan bill. The ranking member on the Senate Finance Committee, Ron Wyden, has decided he does not want to be constructive, and I said, Senator Wyden, it doesn’t have to be my bill. It can be any bill. But no, he doesn’t want to be constructive, and so we won’t probably have that hearing unless he changes his mind, which is unfortunate, because we have the ability to have 60 votes in the Senate, to have the House, and have a president who will sign it, and yet he doesn’t want to be constructive, and since- since it’s so- Social Security is like a child, and you have to you have to care for that child the minute it starts to look ill, and right now Social Security has been looking ill for some time. We as a country, as a government, must care for it, and I feel like that care is being neglected. Incredibly frustrating, but that’s where we are.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Well, yeah, it’ll be insolvent in six years. Medicare, pretty much as well, and yet you don’t–
SEN. CASSIDY: Which is why we should act now. By- by the way, Senator Wyden doesn’t like my plan, so he says, because we borrow 1.5 trillion dollars, we put it in an investment fund separate from Social Security trust fund, put it into the broader economy, and allow it to grow over six decades. At which point it pays for up to 70 percent of what we need to cover the debt for Social Security. He doesn’t want to put tax dollars in, in the stock market. He’s done that before. He has voted for that exact same policy almost for the federal railroad retirement system under George W. Bush, and that’s done fantastic. It works. We know it does. So I think it’s a fig leaf. By the way, I also said let’s bring up Bernie Sanders’ plan. We can do that. But there’s just a refusal to take part of it, and I’m so frustrated. This is so important to our country. Congress is there to take tough choices, and now we’re- now those tough choices are being ducked.
MARGARET BRENNAN: Senator. Thank you for your time this morning. We’ll continue to cover that, and we’ll be back in a moment.
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